Zhong Guo,
I did a short interview for the BBC about what I thought about Google’s censoring it’s search engine.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4650158.stm
Do you know what’s really sad? Some of the people who are saying it doesn’t matter can’t even read their own interviews as the BBC is banned in China. As for the people who can. I wish they would take the position of someone with some political consciousness. If they don’t have it, at least admit that they don’t and not pretend that it’s a just position, and they "speak for" Chinese people. Theirs is simply a position of someone who doesn’t care about free speech or human rights. Using the rights one has, to speak against the fight for those who have-not is hypocritical at best, unconscionable at worst.
And really if they truly wish the western media don’t pay attention to the issue why are they talking to the press?
It makes me furious when I see people who is so casually patronizingly arrogant, accidental birth right doesn’t make one deserve more freedom than their contemporaries.
Yan Sham-Shackleton Online 
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Great interview – I couldn’t agree more with your thoughts.
It’s a huge deal, and I hope that Hong Kong gets full, direct and democratic elections as well!
cheers,
larph //
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Hi there. New visitor to the blog, but just wanted to say that I thought your interview was spot on. Good job for not trying to defend the indefensible.
Not so many people will boycott google, but they’ve completely violated their mission statement. So now we’ll only judge them on how good their products are. Before we would have stuck with them provided the gave us an adequate service. But now as soon as anyone comes along with a better product, people will leave google in droves.
Putting short-term profit over long-term stability = bad business decision.
But I’m slightly troubled/confused. If you’re in HongKong, why was your blog blocked? Are the servers based in the mainland or something? I thought that there was pretty much full freedom of speech in HK – unless you’re a radio DJ…..
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Thank you all.
My site was blocked in China… People in China couldn’t read it, there was a little bit of confusion because I couldn’t see my site in HK as well for a few days.
yan
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Ok, I can understand why it would be blocked in China – of course it’s wrong, but you have to expect it of the government. But, yeah, the HK issue is weird. Did you ever get an answer from the hosts, or were they just
“Oh yeah…err… it was an ummm, technical error. Yes….technical error. That sounds plausible….”
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There is nothing really the host can do, they are an american based company, the blocking comes from within China.
If you’re interested in what happenned. The story is told through some press stories about Glutter. It’s probably easier for you to peruse than me talking about it. It’s 3:44am over here… 🙂
http://www.mooncakeproductions.com/press.html
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Oh sorry, am I keeping you up? ^_^
Thanks for the link – I’ll come back at a better time and/or send you an e-mail.
Toodle-pipsky!
Raj
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China could change overnight… just like the USSR and crap on the economy. Or, it could take a managed approach.
While I understand your concerns, your scope seems much too narrow.
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“China could change overnight… just like the USSR and crap on the economy. Or, it could take a managed approach.”
Who says China has to change overnight? The first thing people like Yan want is democracy for HK. Why is that so bad? It can come with free speech, etc, even unrestricted elections. So why can’t it elect its leader? It’s so ridiculous – Tsang would win if he stood democratically.
As to the mainland. Well what is the CCP’s managed approach? What is their plan? Nothing – they’re trying to buy the rich and influential classes off with money and vague promises. They’re obstructing reform, not promoting it. The white paper INSISTED that one-party rule had to stay. They didn’t even have to say multi-party elections would happen, they could have left that part out. But to AFFIRM that only the CCP has the God-given right to power in China shows their true colours – they have a stick up their backsides and believe people should kiss the ground they walk on.
The Chinese government is not serious about reform – it’s only serious about keeping itself in power at any and all costs.
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OOOOPS!
When I said “It can come with free speech” what I meant was:
“It can COPE with free speech”
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Well done Yan
I was pleasantly surprised to see your face beaming out from the front page of the BBC News site.
It is great to see your cause getting some airspace.
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HK is part of China. It is already getting special treatment. They way you complain is ridiculous, to ask for even more special treatment for HK only.
China’s economy grows at 10% a year. That is the managed approach. Again, you are too narrow.
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Darling Los. I am said to report to you that you feel that having rights is “special treatment” some people feel that it’s a basic human right. One should have it because it’s the best way we as humans have concieved to allow people the freedom to think, and live.
The narrowness really is what you feel you deserve. Personally I feel you deserve more than you want.
That’s okay. Some people like to opress themselves. That I can do nothing about.
as for Justin. Justin S?? What’s this about front page?
Y
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Oh my. I am on the front page…. (is the photo okay I ask in a moment of vanity??) 😛
Oh, as a secondary thing. If you are Mr. S. Look at the name of the journalist. I think she went to school with you.
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Keep up the great work. We need people like you:-)
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Hi Yan,
Faris here – Dunno if u remember me. Maximum respect for your visions, efforts and accomplishments.
I agree with Raj. Reality check here – The PRC is a communist country! In fact, it’s a dictatorship. Have u ever seen anyone vote against any proposal on the NPC in Beijing? What about that Govt. dude that sided with the students on June 4th…sent to ‘correctional camp’. In what other country can you cruise around in a Rolls Royce but not access google or bbc in its entirety?
C’mon face it – tycoons run Hong Kong. Mr. LKS has a share in almost everything. Minimum wage? Racial discrimination legislation? HK has the most uneven distribution of wealth amongst all developed nations, including Singapore, Korea and Japan. Surely not a coincidence.
Universal suffrage would mean that parties that cater towards the MAJORITY (lower to mid income population) would be victorious. That wouldn’t serve businesse interests or the PRC (Motherland???), so that’s a definite no no. As Raj nicely puts it – it’s only serious about keeping itself in power at any and all costs.
I do respect and support the efforts of the HK people. I’ve been in every protest – I’m not promoting violent behaviour, but the people of HK will have to do what it takes, not what it can afford. Otherwise, I’m pretty certain that democracy will always be a distant dream.
FH
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Basic human rights? Want some cheese with that wine?
What I said was that China needs to change in a managed way. Chinese people will have more of the freedoms you write about but only when the nation is ready. If you had it your way, China would be a wasteland. Are you paid by the british to say these things?
There are whiners like you in every country, including wihchever place you consider more “free” than China. Why don’t they change? Because harping on 1 aspect is too narrow-minded and they must consider the intricate ecology running an entire nation.
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Los
What is this managed way? What is the CCP’s plan? What is their timescale? Do you have any idea what their aiming for, let alone how they’re going to get there? No you don’t, because no one knows. The government makes a few vague promises now and again without even giving the impression that it’s going to work towards democracy. When its white paper sounds off in old Communist terms about how one-party rule is good for China and will always be good for China, it’s screaming loud & clear that its merely paying lip service to the idea of political reform.
The fact you have to accuse people of being paid by a foreign government in order to make your point shows your own prejudice and paranoia. Choosing Britain is the worst example, as really most Brits couldn’t care less about China – but it’s an easy one to default to for someone that obviously has a chip on his/her shoulder about the colonial days.
By the way when will China be ready for more freedoms and why isn’t it free now? Are Chinese people too stupid to deal with civil rights and democracy, or something?
I have come across the “China is not ready” argument so many times that I’m not even impressed anymore. Mainland China isn’t ready for democracy yet, but it’s not because the people are “stupid” or “immature”. It’s because the government still wants to cling on to power. They could start a process of democratic reform tomorrow. Perhaps it might take 5, 10, 15 years – but it would happen. As it is, I don’t think they even want it to happen in 50 years.
China will be ready for democracy when the old men in Beijing stop acting as if they were appointed by heaven to rule China…..
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Los. I can’t even be bothered to write down what I think again so I just copied and paste an answer from an interview… (below)
15. Zhao Ziyang has recently died. It is often said that China is not yet ready for democracy, that it must first develop its economy before contemplating a freer political order. Do you agree with this analysis? Whether yes or no, why?
* Firstly, China was a Republic starting from 1911 until 1949. Which was when the communist took over the country, for very good reasons and they deserved that win considering the political situation of the time. If the Japanese Invasion did not happen, which just compounded all the failings of the KMT. China could have remained a Republic and developed into a fully democratic country by today. We had our first ever national democratic elections in 1913. People who talk about “not ready,” seem to think modern China happened with the rise to power of Mao and the Communists. It’s not, they conveniently skipped 30 years of history.
* In terms of the question itself, I pose to the people who say that:
* “Shall we take away democracy from India and the many of the democratic African nations due to their poverty. Put in a totalitarian government until their economy improves and then bring it back to them when some unknown, non-existent body “decides” that they are economically buoyant enough to have self-determination?”
* For those who says and think, “China is not ready,” in effect should be a proponent of the above if we follow their “logic” in a political philosophical way.
* Maybe we can also take democracy away from Germany again because their economy isn’t doing so well. Wasn’t that one of the reasons Hitler gave for the dissolving the German Parliament? Mainly anyone who says, “China is not ready,” is a supporter of totalitarianism. They might jump up and down and say they are not. But I question their familiarity with the debates and concepts of Self-Determination vs. Oppression.
However what amused me a great deal is that you ask such ridiculous questions about whether Britain pays me. Of course they don’t. Unlike totalitarian regimes, democracies don’t tend to pay normal people to stand around touting party line. However we are all very aware that China does… hmmm.. You mean to confess here and now you’re one of the government lackeys. That would not suprized me.
You see in other countries, people are allowed to DEBATE and speak their minds because they feel they can have a say of their government. It’s not intrinsically a problem. It’s part of having a civil society. I am sorry it makes you uncomfortable. Deal with it. See I live in Hong Kong, we have free speech. I can say what I want. I know that’s a new concept to you obviously…. sad but true if you live in a free country and you say you think there is a problem with democracies, it’s allowed. If you’re in a communist regime and you want to speak against the government in an overt way you get put in jail. One you are allowed to put forth either point of view, the other you can’t.
I suggest you open your mind. Otherwise, you’re just brain washed because you’ve never had a chance to think.
Try it. You might enjoy it.
Yan
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I’d just like to jump in here again, if I may.
The reason people like Yan feel the way they do is not because they’re being manipulated by “evil, white-devil foreigners” – it’s because of 150-odd years of British rule. At some point they and their ancestors decided that if democracy was good enough for their colonial masters, it was jolly-well good enough for them too.
HK started its own newspaper groups very quickly and developed a fine tradition of media reporting, with a variety of opinions, because London generally supported free speech – or simply wasn’t interested in maintaining an iron grip over the media. Past generations of HKese grew up in an environment where it was possible to challenge existing ideas without the threat of immediate arrest or Police brutality. Even if they were arrested, it just hardened their determination. And thus they campaigned for the same rights that British citizens enjoyed in the United Kingdom. They would have heard all the rhetoric from Westminster, read about election results and decided that they deserved the same things. Doubtless Yan was influenced by her older relatives in terms of the environment she grew up in.
If you have any complaints, Los, I suggest you send them to the Palaces of Westminster for “giving the natives ideas”. I’m sure that if HK had never become a British colony Yan and her ancestors would have been brought up in the traditional Chinese environment where you lived in fear of the officials having you dragged off for looking at them :p
P.S. Yan, I don’t want to presume how you feel – it’s just that a lot of HKese I know would agree with my theory.
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