From: http://www.b3ta.com/
Look What Google Did
Published by Yan Sham-Shackleton
Yan Sham-Shackleton is a Hong Kong writer who lives in Los Angeles. This is her old blog Glutter written mostly in Hong Kong from 2003 to 2007. Although it was a personal blog, Yan focused a lot on free speech issues and democratic movement in Hong Kong. She moved to the US in 2007. View more posts
Yan Sham-Shackleton Online 
I came across your BBC profile and wanted to check your blog out. And although I agree with you in part on the need for greater freedom in China, I feel like you paint an overly simplistic picture, always emphasizing the negative without acknowledging the great strides made by China.
I must make a disclaimer that I am Chinese American and have not lived in China for an extended period of time. Therefore, I may be completely wrong.
But I do feel that, much like life, China is complex and cannot be simply portrayed in one singular light. For instance, your blog on women rights and how you were denied entry into the tunnel. That was ridiculous, I agree. At the same time, you make it seem like the sexual liberation of the west is something to aspire for, a goal to achieve. I don’t know if I will ever want my little daughter to view Britney Spears as a role model. Forcing women to be “chaste” and “pure” is problematic. But does it really advance feminism and women’s causes to be able to dress like a hooker and sleep with every man that comes across her path (I am not implying that you or your friend are). You are also silent about the Chinese government’s effort to try to address the issue of gender imbalance. Perhaps they can do more, but they are trying through public campaigns.
Please stop fetishsizing the west and be more balanced in your portrayal.
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Stop Fetishing the East, and realise you live in the US. 🙂
You like many Chinese Americans have fond feelings of the motherland and it’s opression because you do not have to live under the regime. May I ask you why you are a Chinese-AMERICAN? in which part of your family did someone there feel that they need to leave China to GIVE YOU a BETTER LIFE?
I think you need to ask those questions of yourself before you start speaking against those who are fighting for rights of people who don’t have it and you have.
Why is not being allowed in a tunnel ridiculous. Oh, maybe because you’re not a Chinese Woman Engineer?
Maybe you should think about how if you were in China, your little daughter could be one of those girls who as abandonned in the fields because China doesn’t allow more than one child, and some people want sons. Do you even have MORE than one children? If you want to, you can HAVE one.
What a luxury….
Y
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Disturbed
You know, I’m friggin tired of hearing comments like Britney Spears is a role-model in THE WEST (sorry, what is “the West”? I don’t see it on any maps). I can assure you that no sane parent encourages their children to be like that. Equally it implies that no Chinese girl acts like that. Well I can say that there are plenty of Chinese lassies that dress in glitter, short skirts, love J/K-pop singers that are like Asian Britneys, etc.
Equally just because some people outside of China go a bit far does not mean China should lighten up more. As Y says, girls are still treated like second-class citizens in many places in China. Almost all orphans are girls – what does that say about mainland Chinese society?
I’d prefer for my countrywomen to be extavert in the way they dress/behave than be dumped on the kerbstone because they don’t have a “winkle”.
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Please read my message more carefully. I said I agreed with you that not allowing a woman down the tunnel was ridiculous. I was not arguing with you on that point.
My family left China because of famine prior to the Communist coming into power. And yes, I acknowledge that I come from a privilege background. But you need to also recognize your privilege having grown up in Hong Kong. The West always protray human rights in terms of first generation rights – the right to vote, the right of expression, freedom of speech, etc. Which are all valuable in their own right. But that simplistic view, like much of your ramblings, masks imperialistic biases. How does the right to vote matter if you are dying of starvation? Few people mention about second generation human rights – the right to housing, education, food, etc.
Where is your mention of the 240 million people that China has uplifted from poverty?
Again I am not saying that you should stop your criticism. I too hope China moves towards greater political freedom. I just would appreciate if you stopped regurgitating the biasd/distorted reporting commonly seen in the West.
And what is the West? The West was created by Europeans who created the concept of “the East” and Orientalism. The East was seen as the “exotic” – kind of the same way you fetishsize the West now.
I also like the hiphenated last name. Let me guess, you only dated white guys. hahahahah
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hey disturbed,let me get this wright.you live in america,your familly left china before communist oppresion.you come from a privileged background.are you defending the communist chinese government? or are you just patronising people from the safety and freedom of your lovely western home? hey whats wrong with britney spears as a roll model?how much money did you make last year?not as much as britney.i love your description “second generation human rights”isnt that communism?what of the 240 million people uplifted,uplifted to where? the factory floor?
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disturbed – that white guys comment was totally uncalled for and says more about the type of person you are than it does about yan.
my parents left china for many of the same reasons as yours, and they most certainly did not sign up for coming to america, only to have the american corporate interests shit all over the rights that every person deserves.
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I love how you all want to paint me as this radical communist so that you can marginalize what I am saying. Second generation rights is a term used by the international human rights community. If you feel that it connotes communism, then you should take that issue up with them. Of course it would be convenient to label that community and myself as a communist, then you can completely disregard the issues we are advocating.
If you think advocating that everyone, regardless of class, race, and gender should be afforded a right to an education, to social security, and to health care is “communist,” then perhaps I am one. I believe these rights are just as important, if not more important than the right to vote or the right to free speech. Why have Third World nations (though I perfer the term Developing Nations) been more supportive of the former rights that I spoke about than the latter? You could argue that they are repressive regimes. But perhaps its because they have different priorities. The question becomes, why have the “First World” been so relunctant to accept those rights as universal? And also from what privileged lens are you looking through.
And I resent that remark about “uplift them where – to the factory floor?” By all means those jobs and working conditions are nothing to celebrate, but its putting food on their table. I’ve organized people who’ve made 2 dollars a day. Save those remarks, especially when you’ve never had to worry about starving or about feeding your family. I’m not saying they should be happy with those factory jobs, but would I rather have them work in those factories than starve. YEAH, DAMN RIGHT I WOULD.
As for the Britney Spears comment, come on now. She married that loser and had to buy her own ring. If that didn’t make you lose all respect for her, I don’t know what will.
Lastly, think what you will about my last name comment. There is nothing wrong with interracial dating, it can be a beautiful thing. What I find problematic are people who only date a certain race, usually white, out of “preference.” Internalized racism isn’t “preference”. Usually its Asian females who are “leaders” and fighters of Asian causes. Rarely do they turn their criticism on themselves and reflect their own stereotypes, biases, and racism against their own community.
Kim, I completely agree with you on your last paragraph. Fuck corporate America.
I shall stop commenting now. This is getting boring and I don’t think I’ve made any of you think. So, yes, “the East is horrible and the West is great”. (note the sarcasm).
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1) The book you are refering to is by Edward Said called “Orientalism.” Believe it or not. I read it.
2) I wrote a whole piece about the Chinese idea of human rights, as in food, shelter, and running water to be a good thing. And that at the time the Communist leaders did the right thing and should have won the civil war. But of course you’re so up yourself that you don’t even know what I feel before you attack my ideas.
3) Shackleton is my step father’s name, and your comment shows you to be completlely stupid. Why? Because someone’s name supposedly would explain how they think. Obviously in such an argument I should say I must not hear a word you say because you named yourself “disturbed.”
4) Lastly, I will tell you something. At the end of the day. I have been doing this blog for two and a half years. I have written extensively on human rights, free speech, and a lot of other things. My name has been attached to those things through time, has gotten some respect. That is my legacy, and whether you agree with it or not, those are the things I believe in and worked for and they last. So whether you have a lot of opinions about my life, who I date, what I think without knowing a single thing about me or what I thought in that two or three things you read of mine. That’s just all it is. A few comments, a refusal to engage in real conversation without smart ass comments, assumptions on my life, it doesn’t show that you have thought through the issues, knowledgeable, and have anything worthy to say without senimentalizing your “ideal” of a country you do not live in.
And as I write this. I see you have left a comment on the blog. I am appauled at your comment about Britney Spears. You look down on her because she is financially independent and choose a man she loves. Therefore she is not someone to respect. I suppose you mean to teach your daughter to attach herself to any man who can afford to buy her a ring, to prove she is smart. It seems you are unable to separate thoughts and ideas out of one’s personal life judgements. Which seems to me that you feel your personal life is beyond reproach and it seems to me that you feel you have a higher intellect, worthy of more respect, and have something really worthy to say just because you married a Chinese man? Well believe it or not, nearly half a billion people in China also married Chinese people. Maybe their freedom is about as important as yours or something like that. (Note, my amused scacasm here also).
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Disturbed
In America (and Europe) there is something called a social security net. You can get free medical care, education, etc.
In China you have to pay for everything – and I mean everything. Ok, there are supposedly plans to help poor families with some cost of education, but the aid support they may get will be nothing like that in North America/Europe. Being poor in the latter is equivalent to being not-so-badly off in the former.
Out of curiosity, ok so many people have been “officially” lifted out of poverty in China. But as China’s GDP has increased has its indication of poverty? Because in many other countries poverty is measured compared to the lifestyle of other people. And as the wealth gap in China continues to increase, I don’t things are quite as rosy as the government likes to portray it.
You know, it’s very easy to deny others rights when you’re ok. I hear and see it all the time in China. The “I’m alright Jack” mentality. It can be even worse than that because I sometimes get the feeling that richer Chinese object to more “freedoms” because:
a) They can buy their way out of trouble
b) They’re worried about the peasants upsetting their new-found wealthy by daring to object to being treated badly
Why is it that the State HAS to punish people so harshly for merely asking for their own rights? Generally the protests and complaints in China are that the LAW isn’t actually being ENFORCED. They don’t ask for democracy per ce – they want to be treated fairly. But ironically because the State is happy to ignore/over-rule its own laws on a whim, it’s going to push people to seek democracy in the future. It also drives them to violence.
I have never heard or seen a logical answer as to why China needs to have such shoddy civil rights just in order for the economy to grow. I mean, Christ alive, the place has been stuck in the bottom ten of Reporters Without Borders media freedom rankings since they started doing their annual figures. The court system is pointless if you square off against anyone in or connected with the State. That is not a healty system. It works now because the economy is growing quickly. But how long will that last? If there were over 87,000 “public disturbances” in China last year (up 6% from 2004) with near 10% growth, what’s going to happen when there’s a recession, or even a significant slow-down?
China is growing on poorly laid foundations. If it doesn’t do something soon, it’ll suffer in the future.
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I’m always amazed at how people with Chinese ancestors yet living in other countries have romantic feelings for China ruled by the Red Dynasty and feel some affection for the simplistic propaganda and this almost Nazi-like motherland talk.
1. Arguements like Disturbed’s always follow very illogical conclusions like:”you criticise China, thus you fetishize all western societies”. So where’s the logical correct conclusion that says:”I’m not perfectly satisfied A, so I like B”? This reverse conclusion can be seen in almost every arguement. is the human brain so incapable of the simpliest logic, making false statements from false logic all the time?
2. I feel alot of sad compassion when I see Chinese people being abused to work in factories and have very little rights. Those people who came from the countryside to sell their health and bodies for a ridiculus amount of a more ridiculus thing–money, with the intention of joining this folie à deux to consume (induced consumption mania).
Again it’s very illogical to assume this human workforce wholesale results in a way out of poverty. Aren’t they just selling the last and only thing they have, their body for being pushed into a money making machine that immediately takes the little things it so >>generously<< gave?
2. About this Britney thing, buying her own wedding ring…
What Yan said about this matter hit the nail right on the head and I hope Disturbed will never have any children to mistreat, what he certainly will do or already does?
This bloke’s opinion on this reflects a very bad part of chinese culture, currently controlling the whole country. If he can spell g.r.e.e.d.?
As a european coming to China seeing this insane amounts of personal greed is really disgusting. I sometimes have the feeling China is in a state extreme freudalism mixed up with some nationlism. 2 Things that led to alot of violence in the past.
It’s so perfectly normal in China to give money to judges, doctors et al just to motivate them to their jobs right or to do other thing’s I really refuse to think about.
However China being under this so called communist leadership while implementing the world’s most capitalistic society is very odd. Maybe China lacks some kind of Renaissance not just those violent outrages strained by some maniacs calling themselves communists.
DISCLAIMER: just for the record, my opinion here does not reflect my opinion on any society, country other than China, please don’t make any false conclusions. I have some harsh criticism on my own >>fatherland<< (the inversion of the guillemets should clear where I’m from :P)
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I’m always amazed at how people with Chinese ancestors yet living in other countries have romantic feelings for China ruled by the Red Dynasty and feel some affection for the simplistic propaganda and this almost Nazi-like motherland talk.
1. Arguements like Disturbed’s always follow very illogical conclusions like:”you criticise China, thus you fetishize all western societies”. So where’s the logical correct conclusion that says:”I’m not perfectly satisfied A, so I like B”? This reverse conclusion can be seen in almost every arguement. is the human brain so incapable of the simliest logic, making false statements from false logic all the time?
2. I feel alot of sad compassion when I see Chinese people being abused to work in factories and have very little rights. Those people who came from the countryside to sell their health and bodies for a ridiculus amount of a more ridiculus thing–money, with the intention of joining this folie à deux to consume (induced consumption mania).
Again it’s very illogical to assume this human workforce wholesale results in a way out of poverty. Aren’t they just selling the last and only thing they have, their body for being pushed into a money making machine that immediately takes the little things it so >>generously<< gave?
2. About this Britney thing, buying her own wedding ring…
What Yan said about this matter hit the nail right on the head and I hope Disturbed will never have any children to mistreat, what he certainly will do or already does?
This bloke’s opinion on this reflects a very bad part of chinese culture, currently controlling the whole country. If he can spell g.r.e.e.d.?
As a european coming to China seeing this insane amounts of personal greed is really disgusting. I sometimes have the feeling China is in a state extreme freudalism mixed up with some nationlism. 2 Things that led to alot of violence in the past.
It’s so perfectly normal in China to give money to judges, doctors et al just to motivate them to their jobs right or to do other thing’s I really refuse to think about.
However China being under this so called communist leadership while implementing the world’s most capitalistic society is very odd. Maybe China lacks some kind of Renaissance not just those violent outrages strained by some maniacs calling themselves communists.
DISCLAIMER: just for the record, my opinion here does not reflect my opinion on any society, country other than China, please don’t make any false conclusions. I have some harsh criticism on my own fatherland (the inversion of the guillemets should clear where I’m from :P)
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